This is topic FOR SALE in forum For Sale at Kristi SnowCat forum.


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Posted by paul (Member # 24) on :
 
I HAVE A KT-3 KRISTI WITH A PORSCHE ENGINE FOR SALE. MIGHT PUT IT ON EBAY UNLESS I GET A FAIR PRICE FOR IT. ACCEPTING OFFERS!! IF YOU NEED PICS LET ME KNOW WHAT YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS IS AND I`LL SEND YOU SOME. ITS LOCATED IN MEDFORD, OREGON THANKS PAUL
 
Posted by paul (Member # 24) on :
 
the serial number is 83!
 
Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
Pictures!

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Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
More pictures!

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Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
Thanks for the pictures Paul!

A few questions. Do it run? If not, when was the last time it did run?

Is the back door missing or was it removed for the pictures?
 
Posted by B Skurka (Member # 17) on :
 
Paul, I attached a link to this thread from the ForumForum website because we have several people over there looking for small snowcats and one or two people looking specifically for a Kristi.

Do you have the rear door? Also, is the driver's door original?

Can you tell us any history about this unit? How long have you had it, etc?
 
Posted by paul (Member # 24) on :
 
THE MAN I BOUGHT IT FROM SAID IT RAN ABOUT THREE YEARS AGO AND THAT THE MOTOR HAD BEEN REBUILT. I REALLY CAN`T PROVE ANY OF THAT THOUGH OTHER THAN WHAT HE SAID. THE BACK DOOR IS MISSING UNLESS ITS A PIECE BLACK VINYL WHICH I FLIPPED UP ON THE ROOF WHEN I TOOK THE PICTURE OF THE INSIDE. AS FAR AS I KNOW THE DRIVERS DOOR IS ORIGINAL. I BOUGHT IT ABOUT TWO YEARS AGO WITH INTENTIONS OF RESTORING IT FOR I ALSO RESTORE OLD SNOWMOBILES. HOWEVER I HAVE WAY TO MANY SNOWMOBILES TO RESTORE INCLUDING A 1947 TUCKER SNO CAT WHICH I PROBABLY WON`T LIVE LONG ENOUGH TO GET THEM ALL DONE. THE GUY I BOUGHT IT FROM USE TO RUN ONE (NOT THIS ONE) HERE TO REPAIR TV ANTENNAS IN THE MOUNTIANS AND PHONE LINES ETC....HE TOLD ME THAT THE KRISTI WAS THE BEST SNO CAT HE HAD EVER RUN BECAUSE OF TRACKS MOVEMENT TO KEEP YOU LEVEL. HE OPERATED ONE FOR OVER 20 YEARS. HOPE ANY OF THIS INFO HELPS. PAUL
 
Posted by B Skurka (Member # 17) on :
 
Paul, I'm curious about your engine. Are you sure it is a Porsche engine? The fan shroud shape and type are identical to the VW units I've worked on, the carburation, oil fill tube and distributor placement are also identical to the VW engines. Do you have any markings on the engine to identify it as a Porsche engine?

Here is a known VW engine a Kristi KT3. The fan shrouds are identical on these two, and match yours. Ditto the other components.


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Below is another VW engine, this is a 1970/71 VW "industrial" engine. Obviously this engine is not in a Kristi, but it shows a good image of the engine. Again, you will see that the fan shroud is identical to your engine as well as to the VW engine shown above. The same is true for the distributor cap, oil filler, etc.

I think you may have been lied to by the former owner?

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[ May 09, 2006, 06:10 AM: Message edited by: B Skurka ]
 
Posted by paul (Member # 24) on :
 
no i`m not sure it is a porsche engine other than what he told me. he seemed quite knowledgable but he could be wrong. how can you tell a porsche engine from a vw?
 
Posted by B Skurka (Member # 17) on :
 
Paul, I am not an expert on Porsche engines, but I know they have a different carburation system than VW had so that would be one clue. Another very obvious clue is the fan shroud, and your fan shroud is an exact match to the 2 VW shrouds I have illustrated. There are more subtle differences like the generator(alternator) tower mount, as well as slight differences in the oil, distributor, etc. There is no oil tank or cooler on your engine that I see, and pretty sure that all the Porsche engines had oil tank?

[ May 09, 2006, 08:48 AM: Message edited by: B Skurka ]
 
Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
Paul,

The shroud could have been replaced on your engine. Here is a picture of a Porsche shroud from the back side. It has a plate on the top with a Porsche stamp.

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Unfortunately, this is the best picture I have at the moment. I don't have my other pictures handy, but will get them and post.

Chris
 
Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
As snowcat operations pointed out at the forumforums site above, the hydraulics are missing from this machine. Do you have the hydraulic tank and valves somewhere else?
 
Posted by B Skurka (Member # 17) on :
 
Paul after consulting a couple more people and looking up some stuff, I am sorry to say that you were very probably duped by the guy who sold you that Kristi. I am now convinced that you have a VW engine instead of a Porsche engine.

Check out this link: http://www.356a.com/engine_identification.htm

You will see all sorts of information, and even a special page on the industrial engines.

The site starts right out by saying that they were based on the 356 Engine. Also, when you look at the valve covers, they are trapizoidal, rather than oval. The Rocker arms don't all ride on one shaft as in a VW motor, the valves are at 45 degrees to the head, so the outside valves, which are the exhaust, each have their own short section of rocker shaft, perpendicular to the 2 center ones that are just the same as a VW. The industrials don't have smaller ports; they have the larger, rectangular ports that were on the 356 car motors. They also had magneto's instead of point & coil. The Mag assembly is much taller than a regular distributor as it also houses the magneto assembly. The pictures are good enough on the above mentioned web site to see a lot of the features I previously mentioned.
 
Posted by paul (Member # 24) on :
 
This might answer all questions towards this kristi.If It did have a porsche engine in it and it did run, whats its worth???? I read the debate over this on the forum and for two hundred bucks i`ll scrap out what i can and junk the rest. thanks paul
 
Posted by B Skurka (Member # 17) on :
 
Paul, recently 2 Kristi KT3 were for sale on Ebay. One was a parts unit, it was not running, but it had the rear door, hydraulic tank, etc. It sold for about $1300.

The other was a running unit in moderate condition for an unrestored snowcat. Again I can't recall the exact price, but it sold for less than $3300. A guy named Mike, who posts under the name Snowcat Operations over on the Forums website bought it, he did a pretty quick restoration that included pulling all new wires, refinishing the exterior fiberglass and fixing things, but NOT stripping it down to the frame and doing a rebuild. He did a lot, but there was not a lot wrong to begin with so it was a modest project but not a massive one. I have no idea what he put into it in terms of parts.

I believe he ended up selling it to his neighbor because he got a good deal on a very rare Thiokol Swamp Cat.

[ May 09, 2006, 07:28 PM: Message edited by: B Skurka ]
 
Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by paul:
This might answer all questions towards this kristi.If It did have a porsche engine in it and it did run, whats its worth???? I read the debate over this on the forum and for two hundred bucks i`ll scrap out what i can and junk the rest. thanks paul

Paul, I think the guys on the other forum are pretty harsh on the condition of your Kristi. Your machine is not complete which makes it worth less, but there is still a market for it. As mentioned, it would make a great donor/spare parts machine for a Kristi owner.

You might consider contacting Gary Wilkinson (The Old Salt) since he is also in Oregon. The company he works for has a Kristi KT-3 that is still used for utility work. I will send you his contact info by email.

Ebay will still probably bring your highest dollar. Here are some some recent auctions of Kristis on ebay:

http://kristisnowcat.com/registry/kt3/00137/ebay7228597636/main.pdf

http://kristisnowcat.com/registry/kt3/00105/ebay7228593197/main.pdf

http://kristisnowcat.com/registry/kt2/00033/ebay4548876940/1main.pdf

http://kristisnowcat.com/registry/kt2/00037/ebay4529757821/1main.pdf

http://kristisnowcat.com/registry/kt3/00047/ebay4505948736/4505948736.pdf

Chris
 
Posted by B Skurka (Member # 17) on :
 
I agree with Chris, I think the estimate at the Forums in the $200 range is very low. However, I also don't think this unit has a lot of value, even as a parts source since it appears that some of the proprietary parts have been removed. Those are the parts that hold value to another Kristi owner.

That leaves the value of an old VW engine and some glass, levers and other parts that can be stripped off of this unit. If the hydraulic rams are there, they could probably fetch $15 or $20 each if the seals are still good. The hatch is wrong. The rear door is gone. The tracks are wrong.

I'd think a better estimate might be in the $350 to $500 range?

EDIT: Paul upon a little further consideration, I think it makes sense to justify my pricing postion a little more on this KT3. Basically I look at your unit as being just a little too far gone to be restored. I also see your unit as missing some of the key proprietary parts that make it a good 'parts' machine. The proprietary parts are what make the difference between a restorable unit, a good parts unit (which could also be considered a challenging restoration), or a low value parts unit.

I once restored an old Oliver farm tractor that was pulled out from underneath a collapsed barn, it took me a lot of time searching junkyards to find suitable original parts, and those I found were purchased at high prices, but they were originals and I was making a "parade" tractor out of a wreck. And there is a very strong collector market for Oliver tractors, national association, tractor meets, etc.

In the case of this KT3, the parts that are missing are important, and they are proprietary, which means you will have to fabricate them yourself (if you are skilled at metal work, welding, etc) or you will pay a machine shop some pretty steep money to custom make the parts for you, or you may be able to find suitable, but not original spec parts that you can get to fit, but will not be proper (and therefore will reduce the collectability of the unit to a future buyer). But those are your options for things like the hydraulic tank, fittings, etc.

And you have to bear in mind that the value of small personal snowcats of any brand is pretty limited. Only the Tucker brand has a strong following and some level of collectability. I know of no other brands that would be considered valuable for collectability. They do have some value as actual working units, but their value is then based on the value of similarly capable units of all other brands. So even the best original antique snowcat has limited collector value, and while some may pay a bit more for the brand of their choice, the return is marginal in real terms.


[ May 11, 2006, 10:40 AM: Message edited by: B Skurka ]
 
Posted by The Old Salt (Member # 20) on :
 
Hey Paul,
Just came across these postings regarding the Kristi KT3 you are selling. Can you tell me who you bought it from? I was examing the pictures you posted of it, and one of the side emblems looks familiar. If it is the guy I think it is, I know him quite well. I have a company Kristi KT3 here in Medford, OR and it had a Porsche Industrial engine in it. You could hardly tell the difference between it and a VW engine. We replaced the Porsche engine with a 1600cc VW engine in 2000. Now only have 32 hours on it.

Gary Wilkinson
 
Posted by flathorn (Member # 27) on :
 
Paul, I am brand new here. Did you sell your Kristi? I live in silverton, Or. I have an interest if it is not yet sold. I have never owned a Kristi. I do have a thiokol Imp.
 
Posted by Livu (Member # 6) on :
 
hi flathorn,
I congratulates to your special Kristi!
Send us still some active photos or few active short movies in the deep powdersnow.
100% much fun with your Kristi.

Livu [Smile]
 
Posted by Livu (Member # 6) on :
 
Hey Chris,
thank`s for the short movie`s!
Have a good time!!!
[Cool] Livu
 
Posted by KT-3 00145 (Member # 51) on :
 
Here is what an original Porsche engine looks like...

http://www.kristisnowcat.com/registry/KT3/00108/index.asp

Dunno how to link directly to the engine pictures, but they are in the lower-right.
 
Posted by KT-3 00145 (Member # 51) on :
 
flathorn has his KT-3 SN 00124 for sale on eBay. 3 days left. I'm bidding, but maybe someone wants/needs it more than me.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Kristi-Snow-Cat_W0QQitemZ290217032960QQihZ019QQcategoryZ6737QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

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Posted by KT-3 00145 (Member # 51) on :
 
It did not sell. I was the high bidder, but did not meet the reserve. So this baby is still available from Byron for anyone who wants a KT-3 dragster!
 
Posted by caroth (Member # 1) on :
 
This Kristi #00083 is no longer for sale. Welcome to Kristi ownership, Kerri.

Byron Miller has two Kristi KT-3s for sale, check them out here: http://www.kristisnowcat.com/forsale.asp
 
Posted by jaerl (Member # 19) on :
 
I just put a Kristi on ebay, here is a link.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Antique-Kristi-SnowCat_W0QQitemZ250561099698QQcmdZViewItemQQptZOther_Vehicles_Everything_Else?hash=item3a569af7b2#v4-13
 
Posted by The Old Salt (Member # 20) on :
 
Chris Roth, do you ever answer any emails anymore ??? Sent you an email some time ago and never got an answer regarding my intentions of selling my KT3 (#48) and the flatbed truck for it. What's going on ???
 




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